Americans shouldn’t be detained indefinitely

Comments

  1. erikhawkes says:

    The NDAA bill provides for indefinite detention of “any person who has committed a belligerent act” (See section 1031 (b) 2 of s1867 (National Defense Authorization Act of 2012). The term “belligerent act” is extremely wide and could apply to any form of resistance including protesting in the streets or even speaking out against the U.S. government.  Both Sen. Jeff Bingaman and Sen. Tom Udall voted YES for this bill. Rep. Steve Pearce voted YES for the house version (HR 1540).  Jeff Bingaman, Tom Udall and Steve Pearce are TRAITORS to the U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights. 

  2. Qui Tam says:

    Remember, New Mexico and most of the United States is the same place where people can be falsely accused, have their lives ruined and watch their lying accusers never be held accountable even after the false charges have been dismissed in a Court of Law and proven beyond a doubt to have been lies to begin with…
    And to think of all the innocent people who have been put to death…

  3. Skeptic says:

    So, where’s the accountability for Obama on this?  

    Gotta admire his chutzpah

    running against war then starting a few.
    selling war to the Nobel peace prize committee 
    brandishing his credentials as a constitutional scholar, then eliminating the right to trial
    conducting secret war by the CIA in Iran and Pakistan

    Most decent citizens are ashamed of their government

    (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V5Oo3gzj2oc&feature=player_embedded)

     

  4. qofdisks says:

    Human Rights: I don’t care what you think
    Geronimo. — 12/20/11 9:16am
     

    I don’t care what you think about whether or not the detention clause in NDAA applies to Americans, it shouldn’t apply to anyone; no human being should ever be held indefinitely, or without the right to a fair trial

    Our constitution and the rights enshrined there-in are very carefully and very deliberately granted to all, NOT just citizens. All human beings require fair treatment not just ‘our team’.

    The Bill of Rights grants no rights.
    It restricts the government from infringing on rights that are presumed already there. And the word “citizen” isn’t used.

    9/11 may have changed a lot, but it shouldn’t change everything. Respect the rule of law. Respect the Truth.

  5. qofdisks says:

    “I recently engaged in a chance, friendly conversation with a man from Algeria which I will share with you.  He was very upset when I told him about NDAA, the new law allowing indefinite military detention of US citizens without charge or trial.  He said he had come here to get away from that sort of thing, which had happened in his country and was fresh in his mind.  His description of what happened in Algeria during its equivalent of Argentina’s “Dirty War” was chilling and he kept shaking his head about the new law here, visibly distressed.
    Basically what he said was that the next step is a large number of people, it was 50,000 in his country he said, will disappear without a trace.  The government will do it to instill fear in everyone else and to show they can do it, and get away with it, so everyone else is much easier to manage.  It will not matter whether you are rich or poor, on the left or on the right, a university professor, a doctor, or if your father is a rich businessman.  It simply won’t matter.  Your family will go to the police station to file a missing persons report but they will not be able to help you.  Left or right doesn’t matter, it is anyone with strong opinions who can express them who are the threat.
    Everywhere you turn there will be a brick wall.  No one knows anything, yes it has been happening a lot, and no one can help.  It will be as if you had never existed.”
    Thomas Jefferson said: “I consider trial by jury as the only anchor ever yet imagined by man, by which a government can be held to the principles of its constitution.” By violating their Oath to protect and defend the United States Constitution, these senators have made themselves “domestic enemies” of the Constitution, and can no longer be said to represent us.”
    http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/12/20/1047327/-Cenk-ON-FIRE-Over-Obama-Pushing-for-Indefinite-Military-Detention-of-Americans-What-Now?via=siderecent 

    Please watch this UTUBE. 
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-tO2irR2Wj8#!

  6. DPW says:

    I agree, Heath,  This is some scary stuff and not to be taken lightly.  You said at the end, “…we may need a citizen-driven effort to pass a constitutional amendment to protect Americans from their government.”  That shows how far our system of government has fallen because that is the whole intent of the Constitution and Bill of Rights.  Those were written to restrain the power of government and protect citizens from the government in the first place.

  7. GFA says:

     
    Heath’s blog discusses a major concern that deals with the ongoing erosions of our constitutional rights, but is only the tip of the iceberg. 
     
     
     
    An 18-month review by the ACLU of the Obama administration’s record on national security issues affecting civil liberties resulted in a mixed review.  The report concludes Obama made significant strides in prohibiting torture, ending secret detention sites run by the CIA, and prohibiting torture.  However, the report is critical of the administration’s failure to deal with military commissions and indefinite detention, and continuing the Bush administration’s “targeted killing” program.  http://www.aclu.org/files/assets/EstablishingNewNormal.pdf
     
     
     
    The Patriot Act, for example, was renewed for another four years, but it has come under scrutiny and criticism as it has apparently given law inforcement and national security agencies a freehand to decide how to apply the provisions of the act.
     
     
     
    For example, a Microsoft official stated earlier this year that any data held by a US company is not protected from the Patriot Act, and such data can be demanded by US authorities.   http://www.zdnet.com/blog/igeneration/microsoft-admits-patriot-act-can-access-eu-based-cloud-data/11225
     
     
     
    US government agencies requests under the Patriot Act to Google for user search information doubled over the last year and are nearly 100% complied with according to the Google Transparency Report.
     
     
     
    And now, there’s ample evidence that much of our law and governmental policy is being made in secret, again contrary to the intent of the Constitution.  Interesting reading on Washingtons Blog, “We’ve Gone from a Nation of Laws to a Nation of Powerful Men Making Laws in Secret”.  http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2011/05/weve-gone-from-nation-of-laws-to-nation.html
     
     
     
    Patrick Henry said, “The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government.”  But it appears the Constitution is becoming meaningless as laws and judicial interpretations infringe on our rights for due process and privacy.  Many examples are given on credible internet news sites and blogs.
     
     
     
    The problem is, once a law or procedure firmly establishes itself, it is difficult to remove it; thus, the weakened state of the Constitution will continue and may get worse.
     
     
     

  8. qofdisks says:

    Native Americans are especially vulnerable to indefinite detention.  Did anyone listen to today’s Native American Call In on public radio at 11:00am today?  Natives are staging a protest walk on behalf of Leonard Peltier and are currently being harassed by the FBI.  It was chilling.  We are all also aware of the FBI infiltrating peace activists such as meetings of the Quakers.  Now, this suspicious law to indefinitely detain on the heels of the OWS movement is terrifying.  Remember that you heard it from me that the day that the government conflates terrorism with the War on Drugs will be the day that our government goes to war with it’s own people.  Given the evil profit incentives of the for profit prison industrial complex in our nation, locking up populations is making the 1% rich on human misery.
    Also, what is this business of indefinite detention for anyone anywhere in the world?  Here we go again with the United States of America policing the entire world.  What does it take to understand?  WE ARE BROKE.  All this world policing and sticking our noses in everybody’s business is being done on the credit card.
    Look, you all know that I am a Liberal but, please change your voter’s registration to Republican and vote Ron Paul even if you intend to vote for Obama.  The people need to use this election to send a Libertarian message.  It has become more important than ever to rein in the power of our government and re-affirm our Constitution and Bill of Rights.
    Also, this is what I wrote at DFNM.

    Where were our Senators with their secret filibusters? It just would have taken one senator to filibuster this dog. Why don’t our politicians of principle play hardball when it comes to defending the people’s Constitution and Bill of Rights? Where is that obstruction when we need it?What is Udall’s and Bingaman’s justification for voting for this?Thank you Representative Heinrich for standing up when it matters.
     
    Now, Sen. Udall has brought forth a bill to clarify that American citizens will not be subject to detention without trial but, watch the obstruction machine of the secret filibuster kick in with that.  And, there is the House of Representatives taken over by the crazies paid off by the bribes from the prison industry to consider.  Sorry but puffed up flapping is not the same as striking with the spur into the opponent’s breast.

    http://www.salon.com/2011/12/16/three_myths_about_the_detention_bill/singleton/  

  9. Qui Tam says:

    Americans shouldn’t be detained indefinitely – for real.

  10. That One says:

    Dictatorships, like the Soviet block of old, are notorious for labeling political gadflies “enemy of the State” to imprison them indefinitely and without trial.  The U.S. at present holds the greatest number of its citizens behind bars of any nation, both in relative (per capita) and in absolute (total number) terms.  So why should we be surprised that our political establishment is set to violate the constitution once again–this time by imprisoning whomever the hell it wants (citizen or not) without trial and for as long as necessary?  We can be wiretapped now for any reason, subjected to pornographic x-rays and pat-downs at airports, and get beaten half to death by police officers dressed in military garb pretty much at will, and all of this in the name of “homeland security.”  Are you feeling secure yet?

  11. dsensiba says:

    This is the real danger of bipartisanism. When the stupid party and the evil party get together and agree on something, you can count on it to be both stupid and evil. The left wing and the right wing are both wings of the same bird of prey, and regular Joes like us are the mouse.
    I know this isn’t a description of everybody, but on the left they usually care about social liberties, but not economic liberty. On the right, they tend to care about economic liberty, but not social liberty. Neither side cares about personal liberty.
    This idea that you can have piecemeal liberty is antithetical to human nature. If you are allowed to associate with whom you choose, but the government has their hand too deeply in your pocket, they’ll use that the take away your other liberties. Conversely, if you are free economically but not free in other ways they’ll use the lack of other freedoms to get their hand into your pocket deeper.
    The right talks about keeping the government out of your wallet, and the left wants the government out of the bedroom, but in either scenario they’re already in the front door. The trick is to keep them out of your whole house. Keep them out of your bedroom, out of your computer and filing cabinet, out of your gun safe, out of your wallet, out of your kitchen and out of your TV set.
    I forget who said it, but a leader in the Libertarian Party said his biggest challenge was to “get the gun guys to work with the drug guys, and vice versa”.
    If you’ll respect my right to keep and bear arms, to believe as I do and spend the fruits of my labor as I see fit, I’m fine with letting you marry who you want to marry, etc. I wish more people would respect everybody’s rights and not let the powers that be divide and conquer us.

  12. JusticeP says:

     
    Will I someday end up on the list for writing something critical about a government official?
     
    It does not need to be writing.  It can just be a disgruntled (jealous) law enforcement officer that uses his position of power to contact the FBI and then Customs and make an allegation of suspicious activity.  In route to Spain, an assistant and I were stopped on the gate ramp to the airplane and detained by a warrantless search for three and one-half hours with the passengers sitting in the plane awaiting take off. The search found nothing illegal. After that, I could not come back into the US without being flagged and searched.  Finally Freedom of Information Act documents revealed to me the source of the allegation, but to my surprise removing the false information seemed not to have an effective procedure.  Order a FOI on yourself and see how much is redacted and who the government says you are.  You might be surprised what your government says about you.
     
    Further, one of our oldest rights, a writ of habeas corpus, has been so procedurally weakened by legislators that it really does not allow US citizens to effectively challenge wrongful or illegal detention.
     
    “But in truth the president has unquestioned authority to detain enemy combatants, including those who are U.S. citizens, during wartime.  Ex Parte Quirin (1942); Colepaugh v. Looney (1956); In re Territio (1946)…Hamdi v Runsfeld (2002).  The authority to detain enemy combatants flows primarily from Article II of the Constitution.” Men in Black by Mark R. Levin.
     
    I don’t think we need a constitutional amendment as the First Amendment gives the US citizen the right of redress.  However, that right seems to be lacking in effectiveness as the state or federal government actor carries “immunity” for their actions if they state they were acting in good faith.  It is the immunity of our government actors, including judges, that needs to be removed in my opinion, not an additional amendment.  Heath is right, however and whatever we need protection from our government.

  13. Dr. J says:

    I couldn’t agree more Heath.  And Americans shouldn’t be murdered by the military and government in assassinations by drones without benefit of due process of law either, but Obama has no problems with that either.  People need to take a look at what is going on here these days, it is very bad for our Constitutional rights.

  14. wedum59 says:

    It seems to me that this is another example of what we get when our legislative candidates get money from special interests instead of having their campaigns financed by US, the people.  Ben Franklin said it best:  “A stitch in time saves nine.”  If we hold the pursestrings, we can keep our politicians under our thumb at all times (hpefully), and focus on how thrifty they are with the campaign money we give them instead of the red herrings they use to distract us.